Scbriml From United Kingdom (England), joined Jul 2003, 7895 posts, RR: 18 Reply 3, posted (1 month 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4848 times:
Quoting Astuteman (Reply 2): Battle of the twins shaping up nicely this year ....
B787's - 79
A350's - 70
A330's - 57
B777's - 30
Those numbers are gross, and Airbus is carrying 23 A350 cancellations. Even so, the numbers are very close 1/3 of the way in to the year. Pass the popcorn!
The Queen is dead, long live the new Queen of the skies.
Wonder which one will take top slot.....
787 or A330?..... biggrin
You know ... I think the A350 actually.
I'm probably wrong, but I expect to see QF, BA and AF join the A350 Queue.
And no major US airlines will order the B787 this year.
Scouseflyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 2191 posts, RR: 0 Reply 6, posted (1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 4656 times:
Quoting Chiad (Reply 5): You know ... I think the A350 actually.
I'm probably wrong, but I expect to see QF, BA and AF join the A350 Queue.
And no major US airlines will order the B787 this year.
other possibilities for big A350 orders are LH and EY
Scouseflyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 2191 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 4639 times:
Forgot to add - the Air Europa cancellation means that the only A350XNB order left on the books is the Kingfisher 5 which was supposed to be converted to part of a new order for 20 XWBs announced last summer but has never been firmed - what betting it happens at Farnborough along with them exercising thier option for 5 more A380s?
BlueSky1976 From Poland, joined Jul 2004, 1015 posts, RR: 3 Reply 8, posted (1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 4615 times:
Quoting Chiad (Reply 5): And no major US airlines will order the B787 this year.
I'm not sure if this will count as a new order, but I expect the NW 787 order go to DL... Boeing could play the twistaroo and announce it at Farnborough as a new order. Technically, it is possible (cancel the NW order, book it as new DL order and assign the NW delivery slots to DL - you know they will do it). Of course everything depends on the regulatory merger approval, but given the poor economic state USA is in, I'd expect them to pull all the stops for any mergers planned or announced...
Scouseflyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 2191 posts, RR: 0 Reply 9, posted (1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4595 times:
Quoting BlueSky1976 (Reply 8): I'm not sure if this will count as a new order, but I expect the NW 787 order go to DL... Boeing could play the twistaroo and announce it at Farnborough as a new order. Technically, it is possible (cancel the NW order, book it as new DL order and assign the NW delivery slots to DL - you know they will do it). Of course everything depends on the regulatory merger approval, but given the poor economic state USA is in, I'd expect them to pull all the stops for any mergers planned or announced...
They could do that, to see if this is happening we need to keep an eye on the 3rd or 4th plane on the line - it's currently going to have a NWA tail on it (see the flightblogger update from end of last week)
Scbriml From United Kingdom (England), joined Jul 2003, 7895 posts, RR: 18 Reply 10, posted (1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4571 times:
Quoting Scouseflyer (Reply 7): the only A350XNB order left on the books is the Kingfisher 5
I don't think this is correct. I believe Kingfisher's 5 firm A350s have already been converted to XWB. The PR around Kingfisher's MOU at Paris last year said as much.
Quote: The agreement is for 15 A350-800 XWB (extra wide-body) aircraft in addition to the five converted from their original order for the A350
At their January press conference, Airbus also confirmed that all outstanding A350 to XWB issues had been resolved (although it's taken until now for the cancellations to be counted).
The Queen is dead, long live the new Queen of the skies.
Scouseflyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 2191 posts, RR: 0 Reply 11, posted (1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4542 times:
Quoting Scbriml (Reply 10): I don't think this is correct. I believe Kingfisher's 5 firm A350s have already been converted to XWB. The PR around Kingfisher's MOU at Paris last year said as much.
Right, I misunderstood that - so we're now at a level A350 playing field situation!
Moo From Falkland Islands (Malvinas), joined May 2007, 2090 posts, RR: 6 Reply 12, posted (1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4517 times:
Quoting Scbriml (Reply 10): I don't think this is correct. I believe Kingfisher's 5 firm A350s have already been converted to XWB. The PR around Kingfisher's MOU at Paris last year said as much.
While I think its going to happen, I am 100% convinced it has not happened yet - every single other A350 to XWB conversion happened via a cancel and rebook, and we have not seen that with the Kingfisher order so I remain certain that the 5 showing on the order book remains the original order. There is no reason for Airbus to handle the Kingfisher order any differently to any of the other conversions.
AustrianZRH From Austria, joined Aug 2007, 79 posts, RR: 0 Reply 14, posted (1 month 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 4349 times:
Quoting Moo (Reply 12): every single other A350 to XWB conversion happened via a cancel and rebook
Actually, didn't they start that just halfway through their conversions? I.e., at first they just left the old orders on the book and counted them on to XWB. An then, sometime last year, they started to cancel and rebook.
I could be wrong though!
WARNING! The post above should be taken with a grain of salt! Furthermore, it may be slightly biased towards A.
Moo From Falkland Islands (Malvinas), joined May 2007, 2090 posts, RR: 6 Reply 15, posted (1 month 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 4330 times:
Quoting AustrianZRH (Reply 14): Actually, didn't they start that just halfway through their conversions? I.e., at first they just left the old orders on the book and counted them on to XWB. An then, sometime last year, they started to cancel and rebook.
I could be wrong though!
The XWB was only given its industrial launch on the 1st December 2006 - only one order for two XWB aircraft was booked in 2006, for Pegasus Aviation as a new customer.
Finnair was the first original A350 customer to convert their order, and that was shown as a new order for 11 aircraft on the 8th March 2007, an increase from the 9 aircraft they ordered at the end of 2005.
All the outstanding XWB orders have been booked as a cancellation and rebooking in the year of 2007, with two cancellations in 2008. Airbus booked 290 XWB orders in 2007 including cancellations and rebookings.
Scbriml From United Kingdom (England), joined Jul 2003, 7895 posts, RR: 18 Reply 16, posted (1 month 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 4251 times:
Quoting Moo (Reply 15): Finnair was the first original A350 customer to convert their order, and that was shown as a new order for 11 aircraft on the 8th March 2007, an increase from the 9 aircraft they ordered at the end of 2005.
But Airbus changed this half way through 2007. In the original March 2007 spreadsheet, AY's A350 order was shown as 2 x -900 (the difference between the original A350 order for 9 and the converted XWB order for 11). It stayed like that until June's spreadsheet, when it was changed to 11 x -900.
I clearly remember this causing confusion last year. Well, for me at least.
The Queen is dead, long live the new Queen of the skies.
AustrianZRH From Austria, joined Aug 2007, 79 posts, RR: 0 Reply 17, posted (1 month 4 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 4207 times:
Quoting Scbriml (Reply 16):
But Airbus changed this half way through 2007. In the original March 2007 spreadsheet, AY's A350 order was shown as 2 x -900 (the difference between the original A350 order for 9 and the converted XWB order for 11). It stayed like that until June's spreadsheet, when it was changed to 11 x -900.
I clearly remember this causing confusion last year. Well, for me at least. Big grin
Thanks for clarification. I didn't know that they have retrofitted the new way of counting conversions to older spreadsheets!
WARNING! The post above should be taken with a grain of salt! Furthermore, it may be slightly biased towards A.
Moo From Falkland Islands (Malvinas), joined May 2007, 2090 posts, RR: 6 Reply 19, posted (1 month 4 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 4160 times:
Quoting Scbriml (Reply 16): But Airbus changed this half way through 2007. In the original March 2007 spreadsheet, AY's A350 order was shown as 2 x -900 (the difference between the original A350 order for 9 and the converted XWB order for 11). It stayed like that until June's spreadsheet, when it was changed to 11 x -900.
I clearly remember this causing confusion last year. Well, for me at least. Big grin
But my point stands, every single conversion has been shown in 2007 as a new order at the end of the year and we have not seen that for the Kingfisher order, and I can see no reason at all for the Kingfisher order to be special in any way.
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